Apple eMate 300 Expansion Module (Open Source / Open Hardware Project)

retr01

Senior Tinkerer
Jun 6, 2022
2,473
1
793
113
Utah, USA
retr01.com
Found some more information about what's in the blocks of 'calibration data' from NewtonTalk. This post talks about what's actually *in* the calibration section a bit. Not all the information, but at least some of it. And the 'factory calibration lost' message probably has nothing at all to do with the battery charge IC, it's the temperature sensor - this makes sense given that all thermocouples and similar temperature sensing devices are variable and need some sort of standard to check against.

Ah. :) Um, the link didn't work? Can you check?
 

retr01

Senior Tinkerer
Jun 6, 2022
2,473
1
793
113
Utah, USA
retr01.com
This can't be the temperature sensor in the battery pack though, correct? I mean wouldn't there have to be some documented procedure on doing some sort of recalibration when you got a new battery pack?

Oh, scratch that. Should have looked at the manual first, page 244:

Replacing the battery
If for some reason, you think you need to replace the battery, contact an Apple- authorized service provider.


I didn't realize the battery wasn't meant to be user replaceable or how important using the same sensor was in rebuilding a battery pack...

But a new battery pack can be built or replaced. See my thread for more information about the battery thingy for the eMate.
 

retr01

Senior Tinkerer
Jun 6, 2022
2,473
1
793
113
Utah, USA
retr01.com
The link is working for me, shows that the Internet Archive captured the URL yesterday. https://web.archive.org/web/20220000000000*/https://marc.info/?l=newtontalk&m=110740915605337&w=2

Hmmm. Not for me?

1661262967162.png
 

Fizzbinn

Tinkerer
Nov 29, 2021
189
183
43
Charlottesville, VA

Yes, I've rebuilt both my eMate's battery packs with new cells, however I kept/reused the temperature sensor from the original battery pack. I'm not sure I've seen reports of anyone building new packs with new sensors. If they were new sensors it seems they need to be calibrated with with data that's stored in the special flash area.
 
  • Like
Reactions: retr01

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
Not sure what's going on with the internet archive. That link which has the * in it would show me the archive history page with the calendar view of when the page has been saved. But now it doesn't. Makes me wonder if the IA is having issues.
 

splorp

Tinkerer
Oct 31, 2021
142
135
43
Calgary, Alberta
splorp.com
Not sure what's going on with the internet archive. That link which has the * in it would show me the archive history page with the calendar view of when the page has been saved. But now it doesn't. Makes me wonder if the IA is having issues.

BTW, the original link to that post on the MARC site is still working:

https://marc.info/?l=newtontalk&m=110740915605337&w=2

Likewise, all NewtonTalk messages going back to June 2001 are also available in the official list archives:

http://newtontalk.net/archive/newtontalk/2005-February/0076.html
 

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
BTW, the original link to that post on the MARC site is still working:

https://marc.info/?l=newtontalk&m=110740915605337&w=2

Likewise, all NewtonTalk messages going back to June 2001 are also available in the official list archives:

http://newtontalk.net/archive/newtontalk/2005-February/0076.html
Sure, the original link is still available. I like to use the internet archive for things like this to be more certain that data is still available in the future. The IA page contains the original URL, so you can check the original source later.

Much data has been lost to link rot, and hitting things with archive.org just helps keep the data around.
 

retr01

Senior Tinkerer
Jun 6, 2022
2,473
1
793
113
Utah, USA
retr01.com
I'm not sure if enough people in the vintage computing community realize the need for volunteers to help pitch in to preserve those sites. It's like the efforts to scan in old instructions, manuals, etc. Many just are like, oh, archive.org has them. Nice Wayback machine. Yet, those links still can be lost due to funding and other infrastructure issues e.g. data center maintenance that affects links.
 

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
A quick update, PCBs for the second production round have arrived but I'm still waiting for the DRAM and flash chips to ship. Once everything arrives here, I'll be able to make something like 25 more upgrade modules.
 

Drake

TinkerDifferent Board Vice-President 2023
Staff member
Sep 23, 2021
447
782
93
A quick update, PCBs for the second production round have arrived but I'm still waiting for the DRAM and flash chips to ship. Once everything arrives here, I'll be able to make something like 25 more upgrade modules.
Is it possible to order a kit from you? sounds like a fun little build :)
 

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
I don't have plans to offer fully unassembled kits unless there's a lot of demand for it.

Something totally unassembled can't be tested at all, and I don't like the possibility of sending something out which won't work even when properly assembled. We're dealing with new old stock parts supplies, so I try to absorb as much of the time cost and risk as possible to be sure stuff works when it arrives.
 
  • Like
Reactions: retr01

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
Main Update:
The DRAM and Flash chips have now arrived, so I can start production of the upgrades again.

Very long secondary update:
I also ordered some of a different DRAM chip to try out and the results are interesting.

These other chips are 8k refresh, 13x9 row and column arrangement, self refresh (I'll call them the 8k chips). The previously tested-working chips are 4k refresh, 12x10 row and column arrangement, self refresh (will call them the 4k chips).

These 8k DRAM chips work too, and report the same 3976k System RAM as the 4k chips. I had hoped that the eMate system would be able to 'pick up' the extra capacity and result in a full 16 megabytes of DRAM - but that didn't work out. Makes me wonder whether a change in the eMate ROM could unlock the extra capacity.

The 8k chips have a row and column matrix which is called out specifically as supported by the CL-PS7110 (successor to the CL-PS7010 in the eMate). The CL-PS7110 datasheet also says that it can support up to 256 megabytes of DRAM. I'd love to update the ROM to make the eMate work with these 8k chips but that's a rabbit hole which might be too deep for me.
 
  • Like
Reactions: retr01

Drake

TinkerDifferent Board Vice-President 2023
Staff member
Sep 23, 2021
447
782
93
Main Update:
The DRAM and Flash chips have now arrived, so I can start production of the upgrades again.

Very long secondary update:
I also ordered some of a different DRAM chip to try out and the results are interesting.

These other chips are 8k refresh, 13x9 row and column arrangement, self refresh (I'll call them the 8k chips). The previously tested-working chips are 4k refresh, 12x10 row and column arrangement, self refresh (will call them the 4k chips).

These 8k DRAM chips work too, and report the same 3976k System RAM as the 4k chips. I had hoped that the eMate system would be able to 'pick up' the extra capacity and result in a full 16 megabytes of DRAM - but that didn't work out. Makes me wonder whether a change in the eMate ROM could unlock the extra capacity.

The 8k chips have a row and column matrix which is called out specifically as supported by the CL-PS7110 (successor to the CL-PS7010 in the eMate). The CL-PS7110 datasheet also says that it can support up to 256 megabytes of DRAM. I'd love to update the ROM to make the eMate work with these 8k chips but that's a rabbit hole which might be too deep for me.
Interesting discovery. It's worth investigation at some point but also begs to question "what can an emate do with 16mb?".
 

Androda

TinkerDifferent Board Secretary 2023
Staff member
Sep 25, 2021
494
530
93
USA, Western
androda.work
Yeah, what could an eMate do with 16 megabytes of DRAM? I really have no idea, mostly just want to enable other people to do things which I am not thinking of. :)

Production will start on the DRAM+Flash upgrades probably a little later this week. And I'll update the product page to mention that it does take awhile after first installing the module before the eMate becomes responsive again. Installing the module triggers a factory reset, which is what uses that time.