Red Ryder questions, unpacking software

[gfuller]

When the machines are connected together, you don't use any AT commands.

Connection settings are set within the menus of each program.

Once the wiring and settings are correct, characters typed on one terminal will appear on the other. At that point, you're ready to receive a file on the SE and send it on the Mini.

I will try directly connecting them tomorrow (or sometime in the near future) to see what that does. Hopefully the wiring is correct and won't require any swapping/the adapter.

You'd be better off with a gurumodem, which allows you to FTP from the modem to your modern computer, save files to its SD card, then download via XMODEM or ZMODEM to your SE with your terminal program. I used this setup for quite a while before I set up a netatalk file server.

You could also get on CQ II BBS (cqbbs.ddns.net:6800) with your current setup and download just about anything you need from there! ZTerm is a much better modem terminal program and you can get it from the Mac Terminal Programs in the Downloads section. You'll wanna connect at more than 300 baud though!

I loaded CQ II BBS and registered... first glance seems like an excellent treasure chest () for old computer users, especially in this case. I was able to get on using Kermit (at 19.2K baud!) and found ZTerm. Now how would I download ZTerm using YMODEM protocol?

I switched back over to QLII and tried to download using YMODEM-G, but the download quickly aborted and QLII started displaying garbage with the Mac beeping. (I also tried entering the"Receive File > Ymodem-G" prompt before starting the download, but it wouldn't let me press enter and kept "holding for header" with no flow.)

Also I had to create a second CQ II account because I had a typo in the username of my first one.

 

[Byte Knight]

I loaded CQ II BBS and registered... first glance seems like an excellent treasure chest () for old computer users, especially in this case. I was able to get on using Kermit (at 19.2K baud!) and found ZTerm. Now how would I download ZTerm using YMODEM protocol?

I switched back over to QLII and tried to download using YMODEM-G, but the download quickly aborted and QLII started displaying garbage with the Mac beeping. (I also tried entering the"Receive File > Ymodem-G" prompt before starting the download, but it wouldn't let me press enter and kept "holding for header" with no flow.)

I've never used Kermit and it doesn't look like a very advanced terminal program so you probably can't even d/l via YMODEM...

I've never used QLII either, and I can't find it anywhere on the internet to try it out. Try downloading using the other protocols like XMODEM. Some wifi modems also require turning off telnet translation by using the "AT*T0" command in order to successfully d/l files.

 

[gfuller]

@YMK After some Google searches and trying some terminal commands, I finally got somewhat closer to having a direct link between the SE and the Mac mini. Following the instructions on Mike's PBX Cookbook, I figured out that I would need a driver to get the serial cable to work since no USB devices would show when running ls /dev/cu.*. I downloaded the Prolific PL2303 driver listed on that page, restarted the Mac mini and still no USB devices showing up. Going back to the Amazon listing, the cable should have the Prolific PL2303 chip. All that appeared after running the ls command was 'Bluetooth-Incoming-Port' and 'wlan-debug'.

I went ahead and tried the "Serial" app they linked, and — on the first try — my cable appeared: Prolific.

And instantly the two computers were talking. As I typed on the SE, the text appeared in the Serial window on my mini. As I typed on the mini, the text appeared in Kermit on the SE.

If that wasn't great enough, I was able to successfully transfer files between the two computers using Kermit, QL II (without MacBinary — though shortened filenames) and even Red Ryder. Red Ryder wouldn't show any keystrokes (unlike the other programs), but it didn't have any problems transferring the files using Ymodem. Sending files from the Mini to the SE, however, wasn't as universally successful. Red Ryder once again didn't have any issues, but QL II messed up the file format (transferred an RTF file... text can still be viewed though, just not formatted and with other random characters) with Ymodem transfer. Kermit also seemed to have successfully transferred the file.

Now I can finally transfer files between my SE and Mac mini without having to power down the SE, remove the microSD card from the FloppyEmu and insert it into the mini, then run Mini vMac to actually export the file from the SD card. This is cool, but I really wish there was a way I could do it from the network/modem so I didn't have to power down the SE every time I wanted to transfer a file after using the modem.

Back to CQ II, I'll have to power down the SE and reinstall the modem to dial it up and see if I can get any of the other protocols work. It seems like I'm going about downloading them the right way, so something must be messed up with the modem settings.

Thanks everyone for the help so far. Hopefully I can get to a point where I can load websites (well, the FrogFind versions) on the SE. I know it can be done... but will I be able to do it?

 

[YMK]

Glad you got it working.

What baud rates were you able to manage?

For Linux, /dev/ttyUSB0 and /dev/ttyACM0 are typical for these adapters. Not sure about the Mac world.

 

[gfuller]

Glad you got it working.

What baud rates were you able to manage?

For Linux, /dev/ttyUSB0 and /dev/ttyACM0 are typical for these adapters. Not sure about the Mac world.

I believe 9600, but I obviously could go faster. I'm assuming I could probably go up to 57.6K, since that is the maximum listed in all three programs? When I ran at 19.2K last night on CQII and telehack it didn't seem to have any problems.

 

[gfuller]

I've never used Kermit and it doesn't look like a very advanced terminal program so you probably can't even d/l via YMODEM...

I've never used QLII either, and I can't find it anywhere on the internet to try it out. Try downloading using the other protocols like XMODEM. Some wifi modems also require turning off telnet translation by using the "AT*T0" command in order to successfully d/l files.

I've finally done some more tinkering with this, and still haven't figured it out.

CQ II gives me three options for downloading the file — Ymodem, Ymodem-G and Zmodem. Since I still haven't got Red Ryder to work (outside transferring files via direct serial connection with my Mac mini), and QL II only has options for Xmodem, Ymodem and Kermit transfers. It still acts like it wants to download the file using Ymodem-G, but after a second or so it terminates then the terminal starts printing garbage and beeping.

My modem has "Handle telnet" unchecked/turned off in its control panel. The "AT*T0" command just returns an "Error" message.

 

[Byte Knight]

I've finally done some more tinkering with this, and still haven't figured it out.

CQ II gives me three options for downloading the file — Ymodem, Ymodem-G and Zmodem. Since I still haven't got Red Ryder to work (outside transferring files via direct serial connection with my Mac mini), and QL II only has options for Xmodem, Ymodem and Kermit transfers. It still acts like it wants to download the file using Ymodem-G, but after a second or so it terminates then the terminal starts printing garbage and beeping.

My modem has "Handle telnet" unchecked/turned off in its control panel. The "AT*T0" command just returns an "Error" message.

I'd transfer ZTerm from your Mac Mini to your SE and see if it's your terminal program.

 

[gfuller]

I'd transfer ZTerm from your Mac Mini to your SE and see if it's your terminal program.

The Ymodem utility in QLII and Red Ryder worked just fine when connected to my Mac mini directly, so I'm leaning more towards something with the modem. TheOldNet modem has an internal file storage (2 MB, so not huge, but usable for small file transfers) that I haven't been able to download files from because the transfer never happens (just like with CQ II). Both Ymodem-G and Ymodem-CRC in QLII (which worked with receiving files from my mini) get stuck at "Holding for header" on both CQ II and the modem.

And, oddly, I haven't been able to find a functional double-density (800k) ZTerm disk image. Everything on Macintosh Garden are SIT archives with files that do nothing when transferred to the Mac via direct serial connection and Ymodem. (I extracted the files on the Mac mini, but also transferred the SIT. StuffIt Lite 3.5 did not see the the SIT.)

 

[Byte Knight]

Try "AT?" and see if there's any way to turn raw mode on and telnet mode off.

You could also send me QLII (transfer it to your Mac mini and zip up the files) and I could see if it works with my wimodem232. Unfortunately I can't find QLII on the net.

Most of the .sit files on Macintosh Garden use Stuffit v5.5. If you're using System 7 on your SE, you could try installing the .bin file here:

https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/stuffit-expander-55

 

[gfuller]

Try "AT?" and see if there's any way to turn raw mode on and telnet mode off.

You could also send me QLII (transfer it to your Mac mini and zip up the files) and I could see if it works with my wimodem232. Unfortunately I can't find QLII on the net.

Most of the .sit files on Macintosh Garden use Stuffit v5.5. If you're using System 7 on your SE, you could try installing the .bin file here:

https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/stuffit-expander-55

I made sure "Handle telnet" was turned off. (The AT command is ATNET0, and I made sure it was unchecked in the control panel.

QLII Fax is available on Macintosh Garden: https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/quick-link-ii-fax

Unfortunately this SE can't run System 7 due to the Mobius '030 accelerator. I think I may have found a workaround, though. I can't find where I put ZTerm on the SE (so I'll have to move another copy over as soon as I have the direct link between the computers), but I was able to un-stuff a SIT for another piece of software. Even though it didn't recognize the SIT archive, I selected "All files" from the dropdown and selected it. There were some warnings ("This archive does not appear to be a StuffIt archive" and "This archive has been corrupted") but the app started right up with no problems. Since I've had a lot of problems getting software to work unless it's a floppy image, it'd be a huge win if I finally figured it out.

Here's a video on what the SE does when trying to download ZTerm from CQII using Ymodem in QL II:

The only way to stop the computer from beeping and displaying garbage is to reset the modem. Sometimes it even locks the SE up, requiring me to reboot it.

 

[YMK]

You have XON/XOFF flow control enabled in QLII. Is that intentional?

 

[gfuller]

You have XON/XOFF flow control enabled in QLII. Is that intentional?

The modem has software flow control enabled, and instructions say to have XON/XOFF enabled.

 

[YMK]

You could try not pressing enter before starting to receive.

 

[gfuller]

You could try not pressing enter before starting to receive.

I've tried calling up the Ymodem transfer before pressing enter and still nothing... it just sits there and does nothing.

 

[Byte Knight]

I made sure "Handle telnet" was turned off. (The AT command is ATNET0, and I made sure it was unchecked in the control panel.

QLII Fax is available on Macintosh Garden: https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/quick-link-ii-fax

Unfortunately this SE can't run System 7 due to the Mobius '030 accelerator. I think I may have found a workaround, though. I can't find where I put ZTerm on the SE (so I'll have to move another copy over as soon as I have the direct link between the computers), but I was able to un-stuff a SIT for another piece of software. Even though it didn't recognize the SIT archive, I selected "All files" from the dropdown and selected it. There were some warnings ("This archive does not appear to be a StuffIt archive" and "This archive has been corrupted") but the app started right up with no problems. Since I've had a lot of problems getting software to work unless it's a floppy image, it'd be a huge win if I finally figured it out.

Thanks for the link. I fired up QL II and quickly realized that I haven't updated the ASCII portion of the BBS in way too long! I couldn't get downloads to work at all with my wimodem232. So I fired up ZTerm and could only get ZModem protocol to work for downloads...

 

[gfuller]

Thanks for the link. I fired up QL II and quickly realized that I haven't updated the ASCII portion of the BBS in way too long! I couldn't get downloads to work at all with my wimodem232. So I fired up ZTerm and could only get ZModem protocol to work for downloads...

No problem. I've noticed CQ II looks different in QL II than Kermit... I'll try to get some "screenshots" when I have the modem connected again.

I tried finding a StuffIt Expander that would successfully un-stuff the ZTerm SIT, but no luck. I thought the disk images for StuffIt Deluxe 4.0 would work, but for some strange reason my FloppyEmu hates those image files. (Even the filename glitches, but the FloppyEmu gives me a "Disk image type is not supported in the current emu mode" error when trying to load it.) I found a StuffIt Deluxe 3.5.1 self-extracting MacBinary archive (-sea.bin) that I successfully transferred over to the SE using Ymodem in Red Ryder, which extracted disk copy images for the software. Unfortunately I don't have any blank 800K image files on my FloppyEmu, so I'll need to create those, copy them over and (fingers crossed) run the installer.

It seems like every time I think I find a way it doesn't work.

 

[Byte Knight]

I tried finding a StuffIt Expander that would successfully un-stuff the ZTerm SIT, but no luck. I thought the disk images for StuffIt Deluxe 4.0 would work, but for some strange reason my FloppyEmu hates those image files. (Even the filename glitches, but the FloppyEmu gives me a "Disk image type is not supported in the current emu mode" error when trying to load it.) I found a StuffIt Deluxe 3.5.1 self-extracting MacBinary archive (-sea.bin) that I successfully transferred over to the SE using Ymodem in Red Ryder, which extracted disk copy images for the software. Unfortunately I don't have any blank 800K image files on my FloppyEmu, so I'll need to create those, copy them over and (fingers crossed) run the installer.

Another option would be to set up the BasiliskII emulator on your Mac Mini (or modern Mac), install Stuffit Expander v5.5 on there, unstuff ZTerm, then copy ZTerm to a blank 800k disk image (which you can download online), then copy that disk image to your FloppyEmu.

EDIT: I just did it for ya - see attached file.

 

[gfuller]

Another option would be to set up the BasiliskII emulator on your Mac Mini (or modern Mac), install Stuffit Expander v5.5 on there, unstuff ZTerm, then copy ZTerm to a blank 800k disk image (which you can download online), then copy that disk image to your FloppyEmu.

EDIT: I just did it for ya - see attached file.

Thanks for the ZIP file. It allowed me to finally get ZTerm running on the SE. I'm probably going to create a separate thread in the "Emulation" category for this, but Basilisk II for some reason refuses to run on my M1 Mac mini. I've had BII running perfectly fine in the past on multiple Intel Macs, and I believe I even had it running at one point on my M1 mini. Now when I try to start BII on my mini it instantly crashes. I checked the setup GUI and everything looks like it should. All settings match what is mentioned on the Emaculation guide (which I've followed in the past with no issues) and I'm using the same old world ROM file that worked in previous installations. System 7.5.3 installer and Mac OS 8 Disk Tools are also mounted. This isn't a new issue, unfortunately. It makes me wonder if I should completely remove the current Basilisk files, download the latest version and see if that makes a difference? (Basilisk II has been temperamental for me in the past, especially on Windows machines.)

As for ZTerm, it opened fine on the SE. However (besides Red Ryder, which doesn't display a terminal at all?), CQ II appears even worse in ZTerm than it does in Kermit or QLII. Unlike Kermit and QLII, ZTerm loads the black "background" and other graphics that makes certain elements invisible. I couldn't even attempt to download a file because it wouldn't let me "flag" a file for download? At best CQ II is broken on ZTerm on my SE and some features don't appear to work.

 

[Byte Knight]

Thanks for the ZIP file. It allowed me to finally get ZTerm running on the SE. I'm probably going to create a separate thread in the "Emulation" category for this, but Basilisk II for some reason refuses to run on my M1 Mac mini. I've had BII running perfectly fine in the past on multiple Intel Macs, and I believe I even had it running at one point on my M1 mini. Now when I try to start BII on my mini it instantly crashes. I checked the setup GUI and everything looks like it should. All settings match what is mentioned on the Emaculation guide (which I've followed in the past with no issues) and I'm using the same old world ROM file that worked in previous installations. System 7.5.3 installer and Mac OS 8 Disk Tools are also mounted. This isn't a new issue, unfortunately. It makes me wonder if I should completely remove the current Basilisk files, download the latest version and see if that makes a difference? (Basilisk II has been temperamental for me in the past, especially on Windows machines.)

BasiliskII works fine on my on my M2 MBP so I'd try a fresh installation.

As for ZTerm, it opened fine on the SE. However (besides Red Ryder, which doesn't display a terminal at all?), CQ II appears even worse in ZTerm than it does in Kermit or QLII. Unlike Kermit and QLII, ZTerm loads the black "background" and other graphics that makes certain elements invisible. I couldn't even attempt to download a file because it wouldn't let me "flag" a file for download? At best CQ II is broken on ZTerm on my SE and some features don't appear to work.

Progress! Try this if you haven't already: Go under Settings -> Terminal and select zt-ibm font and make sure PC ANSI-BBS is checked.

 

[YMK]

Looks like ZTerm is trying to display color. Does it have options for disabling foreground and background color?

@Byte Knight - is CQII usable without escape sequences?