Great work on the firmware adjustments. I have an m127 machine which appears to be much the same as the kodak etc but runs different firmware. I managed to take a dump of it but have struggled to get a bootable image flashed back. As you seem rather skilled with messing with firmware I don't suppose you can take a look, perhaps you cans shed some light? I'm having to flash the rom back with a chip programmer currently as I can't seem to make anything flashable with the ntk tools (it's a dual partition image unlike the kodak and other models it seems).
Modding the Kodak Reels 8mm Film Digitizer (Firmware Hack)
- Thread starter Mac84
- Start date
This my first time a firmware hacking, and I starting with a working firmware update procedure. Without the stock firmware update step, I wouldn't have gotten anywhere. Sorry, I have no idea about the firmware partitioning.
@0dan0, one new bit of feedback for you on your v5.7 firmware. It seemed to not be saving the MP4 file to the SD Card when the card was formatted ExFat. The only indication that it had not been saving on the ExFat formatted SD card was after I had (seemingly) captured a full 3" reel, I opened the SD card up on the computer and their were not contents on the card (not even the folder you have it save to with).
Once I formatted the SD card to Fat32 from my computer, I was able to complete a successful capture.
Also, before I had discovered this, on my first capture attempt this morning, after the capture I went into the Menu and attempted to view "My Recordings" of whatever it is. This caused to the system to freeze and then shut off (if I remember correctly). Perhaps that behavior was caused by the SD card formatting issue I described above.
Once I formatted the SD card to Fat32 from my computer, I was able to complete a successful capture.
Also, before I had discovered this, on my first capture attempt this morning, after the capture I went into the Menu and attempted to view "My Recordings" of whatever it is. This caused to the system to freeze and then shut off (if I remember correctly). Perhaps that behavior was caused by the SD card formatting issue I described above.
@ThePhage I didn't think exFAT was ever supported, just like any large cards aren't supported. I just tried at 128GB exFAT card, and it behaved as it was recording, yet not even the folders where created. I did format a 32GB card as exFAT, and that did work. However there would be no advantage to do so, and the old Novatek system doesn't use 64-bit MP4, so 4GB is still the file size limit. I don't think this is something I have broken.
Good to have the confirmation on the behavior, thanks. I believe on my previous B Unit (with Mac84's firmware) I was able to use an ExFAT 64GB card for captures without issue, although the firmware update process did seem to need the FAT32.
Version 5.8 Attached.
This version correctly sets the full range flag within the `avcC` MP4 atom. So not a big change, but will save you the workflow steps having to correct the files will FFMPEG after capture.
Normally the Novatek SoC gets the 'avcC' data from the compression engine, but as it is getting it wrong, I use the one FFMPEG created and placed that in the firmware at offset 0x33A440. This is not new MIPS code, just a raw dump of what should be written to the MP4 header. I stored this is some the free space created by removing and resizing the JPEGs.
The code was changed at offsets 0x1ec104, 0x1ef458/64 and 0x1efc2c/38, simple to point at the new `avcC` (0x33A440) rather then using the one generated (0x80e55854).
This version correctly sets the full range flag within the `avcC` MP4 atom. So not a big change, but will save you the workflow steps having to correct the files will FFMPEG after capture.
Normally the Novatek SoC gets the 'avcC' data from the compression engine, but as it is getting it wrong, I use the one FFMPEG created and placed that in the firmware at offset 0x33A440. This is not new MIPS code, just a raw dump of what should be written to the MP4 header. I stored this is some the free space created by removing and resizing the JPEGs.
The code was changed at offsets 0x1ec104, 0x1ef458/64 and 0x1efc2c/38, simple to point at the new `avcC` (0x33A440) rather then using the one generated (0x80e55854).
Bit of an off topic question, but some of my old reels don't have much of a leader to the film. Does anyone still sell splicing kit materials (tape/glue) and blank leader to pad out a roll of film? Suggested sources in USA? (I haven't searched or checked say B&H, Adorama, etc. yet.)
I’ve purchased leader, press tape, Film Renew and other supplies from Larry Urbanski: https://urbanskifilm.com/supplies.html
Definitely recommended.
Good news, I now have Type-A, Type-B and Type-C Reelz/Reels scanners in my possession. While I intend to find additional extensions, I will catch the other units up first. Also have new lenses arrivng today.
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Hey guys, what you are doing with the Kodak reels is incredible! I'm very inexperienced in the "hacking/modding" world still but I had a thought and wondered if you guys think it's possible.
What do you guys think about a 16mm mod?
Do you think it is possible to physically modify the viewing window for 16mm film? I haven't had an opportunity to open my unit up yet, but from what I can see the exposed light is at least big enough to shine between the perforations on 16mm film. It seems there may be a little more light area that I can't see since switching from super 8 to 8mm shifts the entire plastic view guide. My idea there would be to 3d print a different view guide.
I saw user @wnt2fly included the wolverine hawkeye mod on the forum and it seems to keep the view gate area open. I would probably 3d print several different gates (super8/8mm/16mm) and swap them out as needed.
Next would be modifying the film advancer. Now physically I think it should work? I haven't plugged in my unit to see how the movement works (before I got kodak I thought it may be a sprocket) but looking at it this morning I saw a tiny single piece of metal sticking up on the left side of the film guide. Has anyone that's opened the kodak looked closely at these parts? Does anyone know if it advances like a shuttle with teeth (like on a projector)?
I'm assuming (haven't looked at any of the firmware or code on a computer yet) that it would be possible to adjust the timing and positioning for the advancer in the software. The only thing here that I think might really trip up the process is figuring out how far that tiny prong can move (if it can move side to side far enough to advance slightly wider film, a difference of 3.26mm). As far as I understand, right now it can move the film 4.23mm, but for 17mm it needs to move the film 7.49mm.
I know it's ambitious. What do you guys think? Is it possible? Is there anything I'm overlooking that might make this impossible?
What do you guys think about a 16mm mod?
Do you think it is possible to physically modify the viewing window for 16mm film? I haven't had an opportunity to open my unit up yet, but from what I can see the exposed light is at least big enough to shine between the perforations on 16mm film. It seems there may be a little more light area that I can't see since switching from super 8 to 8mm shifts the entire plastic view guide. My idea there would be to 3d print a different view guide.
I saw user @wnt2fly included the wolverine hawkeye mod on the forum and it seems to keep the view gate area open. I would probably 3d print several different gates (super8/8mm/16mm) and swap them out as needed.
Next would be modifying the film advancer. Now physically I think it should work? I haven't plugged in my unit to see how the movement works (before I got kodak I thought it may be a sprocket) but looking at it this morning I saw a tiny single piece of metal sticking up on the left side of the film guide. Has anyone that's opened the kodak looked closely at these parts? Does anyone know if it advances like a shuttle with teeth (like on a projector)?
I'm assuming (haven't looked at any of the firmware or code on a computer yet) that it would be possible to adjust the timing and positioning for the advancer in the software. The only thing here that I think might really trip up the process is figuring out how far that tiny prong can move (if it can move side to side far enough to advance slightly wider film, a difference of 3.26mm). As far as I understand, right now it can move the film 4.23mm, but for 17mm it needs to move the film 7.49mm.
I know it's ambitious. What do you guys think? Is it possible? Is there anything I'm overlooking that might make this impossible?
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@Gwennia This was one of my earlier observations while improving the resolution, the original lens's FOV fully covers what is necessary to scan a 16mm film. It was like the origin optical system was designed for 16mm, not 8mm, even the current light bed is pretty good for standard 16mm.
Using the new firmware, zooming out (the limiters where removed) with the original lens, here with Super16mm picture region overlayed (even Ultra16 would work):
So the only issues are mechanical, as today hacked firmware would support it. Just 3D print the film path and guide, and resolve the socket feeder.
P.S. As I'm hacking Type A & B, I will retry the above image with the image resolution (using the stock lens.)
Using the new firmware, zooming out (the limiters where removed) with the original lens, here with Super16mm picture region overlayed (even Ultra16 would work):
So the only issues are mechanical, as today hacked firmware would support it. Just 3D print the film path and guide, and resolve the socket feeder.
P.S. As I'm hacking Type A & B, I will retry the above image with the image resolution (using the stock lens.)
Yes! Your attached picture is what gave me the idea actually! I noticed that there seemed to be quite a bit of extra light bed aread around the super 8 film. I started researching the super 8 digitizer because I thought all my film was super 8. When I went digging through the boxes I realized half was 16mm. Then, after scouring the internet I found that there is no consumer level digitizer option for 16mm and the only option is to diy completely from scratch. (I have a plan for that if this doesn't work out.)
If the socket feeder can work, then ideally I would have 3d printed plates that I could swap out, and I would reflash the firmware for whichever film I wanted to digitize at the time.
My Type-A might be now dead, the SD Card slot broke when opened the case. I will get a replacement ordered, but the is now missing pad (from the removal), this might be hard to repair. Think this was just a shield ground, as it doesn't connect to the SD Card pins, but now one of those lines mine be missing ground.
So I dug into the machine. The advancing mechanism may be too much of an obstacle for 16mm. If anyone has any ideas on a way to increase the distance it can travel by around 3mm let me know. Here's some videos of how the mechanism moves. It looks like the stepper motor has an oddly shaped plate that manipulates the outer plate up/down/left/right. It seems too locked into that specific movement pattern I think.
@0dan0 that's a bummer about the type-a SD card slot
@0dan0 that's a bummer about the type-a SD card slot
Attachments
What is the current suggested settings on the latest sets of code? E.g. should we be zooming all the way out still, doing any other setting changes before running the scan and postprocessing?
Hi @Gwennia,
For some reason I couldn't get the first video to play or download, and I'm curious to see more of that mechanism in action. It seems that all you may need to do is 3D print a new cam (the weird shape plate on the end of the stepper motor), to make the socket move path longer. My reaction, after the surprise this is a cam, that would be much easier than I would have thought. To increase the move distance by 3mm, you increase the radius of the bump in the cam about 1.5mm (as it is about half way down, the lever is amplify about 2x.)
You will not gain any resolution either way, without replacing the lens. The new firmware has other advantages (I think anyway), but the resolution can't be firmware changes alone. The stock lens sees area of around 17mm wide (for the readout mode used), the firmware simply removed (mostly) the limiter for the readout window. The Super8 active picture is only 5.8mm wide, so for a 1920 readout (the max) only (5.8/17)x1920 = 655 pixels are of the Super8 film. This is before any processing, so your maximum resolution for a scan is 655x451. With a lens change I have got this to around 1560x1080. It is technically possible with the perfect lens to go a little higher, although Super8 likely doesn't need it. The original firmware scanned and processed at ~840x632 in max overscan (zoomed in it might be only 400x300), then scaled to output to 1728x1296 (very very weird.) My firmware scans and processes 1600x1200 (at max overscan) and encodes at 1600x1200, removing any upscaling in overscan. However with the stock lens you have to zoom in, so you will still be processing only ~700x500 and scale that to 1600x1200.
Likely more answer than you wanted.
Pros or full overscan (stock lens)
- The sharpness works more correctly
Cons:
- exposure will not be ideal, sampling too much non-picture data
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Here's the video reposted, hopefully it works for you @0dan0. I'm not sure that I'm mechanically inclined enough to solve that problem right now. I think I found some of the code related to the motor function, at least potentially where it was choosing between the super 8 and 8mm switch. But that turning mechanism is a little above me. I can look at it and understand what it's doing, but I have no clue how to change it to increase the distance it goes. I'm guessing I'd have to pull that plate out completely to figure it out.